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Monday, January 14, 2008

A Word on Commenting

Friday night I posted a message from Ronnie Pineta, that some misread, as a possible call for a work slowdown at the newspaper. This was not Ronnie’s message; his message is requesting everyone in the pressroom wear their black shirts on Friday’s to show unity and nothing more.

I sat on several comments for three days and decided to publish what was said on Saturday morning, and hope in the future names will be omitted, especially if the commenter is angry.

36 comments:

Anonymous said...

Before they were protected by labor laws or a grievance procedure, workers found that they were able to accomplish their goals through “ concerted activity.” concerted activity was deemed destructive, therefore, both labor and management agreed to abide by collective bargaining, mediation, grievance, and arbitration procedures to insure highly competitive and productive companies.

Looks to me that these guys were doing more than just wearing a stupid T-shirt!! Get real Ed, take the blinders off, the negotiating team is in trouble, we all know it, and they will do whatever their union handler tells them to do... including sabotage!!!

Ronnie Pineda said...

The negotiation committee is NOT in trouble! negotiations are going as expected and will continue to proceed forward. The company has stated that they are revising their proposals and we expect to begin making progress very soon.

Let me be clear, that "Solidarity Counts" post was from a Teamster publication and it in no way calls for sabotage. I do not condone or promote sabotage and warn that anyone considering this behavior risks termination.

Anonymous has a vivid imagination and reads alot more into the post than is actually there. It's probably dark under the desk making it difficult to read properly.

Concerted activity can be many things. The operators collectively stood up to Walker when he crashed their operators meeting and began ranting over their performance.

Not willing to accept his behavior and hostility, the operators in UNITY defended their position and shut him down. Walker then went apologizing to all the operators for his behavior.

THAT WAS A CONCERTED ACTIVITY!

Walker must have realized that the operators control the presses and ultimately, the pressroom itself.
All of our operators need to make the same realization.

Anonymous is most likely management or one of their flunkys attempting to discredit the committee and its efforts to negotiate a collective bargaining agreement. We all know who they are and what their motives are.

They are deluted in believing that they will survive without a Union.
They are only concerned about themselves and how they can improve their position and are willing to throw everyone else to the wolves. They cannot be trusted and their message ignored.

THE COMMITTEE IS STRONG, UNITED, AND COMMITTED TO SECURING A FAIR COLLECTIVE BARGAINING AGREEMENT.

Why should anyone pay attention to anyones comments if they don't have the courage to disclose their identity. Union supporters don't hide their identities and don't need to because we are right, and not afraid to show it.

Anonymous said...

Ronnie it is hilarious to watch you and Ed backpedal on this one. Perhaps the union reps told you you crossed the line? The process is going well or as expected?? And you ment you were supposed to where your union t-shirts on Fridays?...sure and I have land in New York city for sale too. We all know what you were implying in your rant. Oh and lastly ... the light under the desk? How is the light under your desk, you should be back on the floor soon to your skilled trade ?? Your cushy little office job, I hope you havent forgot how to put tape on paper but if you did I volunteer to get someone at Home Depot to show you how its done.

Ronnie Pineda said...

I nor Ed were ever told we crossed the line by anyone, simply because we haven't. Your reference to N.Y. makes no sense, (go figure)

I had a full knee replacement and returned to the floor less than seven months later. Someone such as yourself would probably still be off work milking it.

You probabaly would have had diffculty doing the PRS I was helping Mrs. Coleman do while on light duty. I returned from light duty earlier than prescribed by my physician because I knew I could and didn't take advantage of the light duty made available to me during my recovery.

Lastly, had we not won our election, there would be no one in front of home depot because they would all be in the reelroom doing our jobs for 1/3 the wages.

That means 2/3rds of us would probably not be here right now.
"Reeltenders" in our pressrooms has been a rumor that had yet to come to pass and we've all seen what happens with rumors.

Outsourcing Transportation, Closing Northridge, and many others all began as rumors so whats to say this wasn't next on their list.
Remember, they were looking for $200,000,00.00 and none of it came from the pressroom this time!

Anonymous said...

Silly me I am always so impressed with the hard work of everyone in the reel room. Reading massive books, sitting back in your chair like your at home, and falling asleep. Ya I think someone at Home Depot could learn that quickly. I dont like the outsourcing of jobs in the company but have you looked at the declining revenues of this paper???
Yes 2/3 of you wouldnt be there, so when OC is closed you will know what will happen. After all when Detroit closes plants the workers are let go, they dont get to transfer to other facilitys.

Anonymous said...

Hey Ed what happened to Ronnie's post (see below)? Did you take it down? Why?

"Solidarity Counts"

"Managers, company presidents and supervisors have numerous resources available to them to accomplish their goals, they belong to associations and coalitions that help advance their objectives. Workers, on the other hand, have only their numbers to protect them, and the numbers by themselves do not insure success. It requires that the workers act in unison to achieve better wages, hours and working conditions."

"The union is only as strong the members who make up the unit. The best negotiator in the world cannot achieve a good contract without the support of the members. If you look at the structure of most organizations and analyze the source of power, the importance of mobilization and participation becomes clear."

"Before they were protected by labor laws or a grievance procedure, workers found that they were able to accomplish their goals through “ concerted activity.” concerted activity was deemed destructive, therefore, both labor and management agreed to abide by collective bargaining, mediation, grievance, and arbitration procedures to insure highly competitive and productive companies."

"Unfortunately, management’s attitude toward the very procedures that were designed to keep workplace conflict peaceful has deteriorated. A central tactic in their strategy to undermine the strength of organized workers is delay. Delay in bargaining, delay in grievance handling, delay in mediation, delay in board hearings, and delay in addressing crucial safety and security issues.
Sometime, the only way to demonstrate to management the importance of following the proper procedures in a timely manner is to show what happens when workers flex their muscles or use concerted activities. Acting together can be done in a number of very creative ways as long as the group activity is well planned, well supported and part of an overall strategy."

Ed Padgett said...

The post was removed at Ronnie's request last night.

Anonymous said...

The post was removed by Ronnies request? I would want it removed to I am sure he wishes he never opened his mouth. I am sure the union boss said you went to far and the Tribune attorneys excited about this slip of tongue. LET THE BACKPEDALING BEGIN. I think it is hillarious you removed your post , If you truly beleived in this drivel you would have left it for more employees to read.

grandspud said...


Blogger Ed Padgett said...
"The post was removed at Ronnie's request last night."


Hey, does that mean we won or something?

I haven't asked for any of my posts to be "removed."

I think in sports, when the other team packs up and leaves, it's called a forfeit or something like that.

grandspud said...

Hey Ed,

I have no problem with you honoring Ronnie's request and removing his "Solidarity Counts" post. However, some of my best lines were written in response to that misguided document. I put a lot of really hard work into those replies and now they're all gone. My wife even got pissed because I was toiling at the computer for so long. :(

I have an idea. How about putting our replies back, just don't post Ronnie's original document? You can leave a big, fat, blank space where his post was.

It seems a bit one-sided to have all our opinions censured because the initiator got a little nervous.

Thanks,
grandspud

Ed Padgett said...

Gran Spud,

Unfortunately when the post was erased, so were the comments, with no way to restore either. There is a slim chance the post and all the comments could be on my server, as I do not use blogger to store my blog. If I have the time I will run a search and see what I come up with, but it may prove fruitless, as we have many years of files and photographs in one folder.

I did ponder just removing the post and leaving the comments, but in hindsight, it may be too late to reverse?

Anonymous said...

anonymous? do you know me:philip chandler..we can all cast dispersions while maintaining a facade of actual interest,if you really cared.(which you don't) you would stand behind youre comments with a name...anonymous is tantamount to COWARD!which means you are too afraid of either youre shawdow or opine,or both.be a real man,stand up,and walk tall.
why don't you shock us all and cast off the shackels of oppression.
after reading youre comments I seriously don't think their is a closet big enough in this world to hold you back.with all that pride emanating from youre keyboard: good luck.
disrespectfully not youres
philip chandler

Anonymous said...

The government is like a baby's alimentary canal, with a happy appetite at one end and no responsibility at the other.

-Ronald Reagan

Sounds like what is going on here!

From another "coward" to "I lost my silver spoon"!

Wolf said...

Is senior management at the bottom of the alimentary canal? Anytime there is bad news, Sr. Management "Dumps" the mess on people, with no thank you, or an atta boy/girl. I have yet to see a plan that makes sense and helps everyone grow together at this company. Instead we have a fragmented company who’s Sr. Management finds time to pick on the people who “make it happen” everyday. (Pressmen) .Management seems to forget that they have the vision, but we have the “know how”. Management seems to "find time" to sneak around plants looking to see what everyone else is doing, and not putting the effort we deserve in bringing together answers that help us all grow together, and make this paper the best product that we believe it was once. We need to bring the LAT back to a respectable Operation where people do not fear for their jobs; instead we should be focused on bringing back 100% production capacity to LA. Let us adhere to our “new” Policy Manual and keep our word. Grow the business, and not get bogged down with stupid childish antics that do nothing but polarize our work environment more that it already is. Lets grow up and put our differences aside, and work together to make this the best place to work, and show the rest of the industry that we have the ability to rise to the challenges that have been put before us.

Anonymous said...

Wolf that was sweet. Grow the business ? How do you propose doing that if you close OC? I see the press order amounts globaly everyday and a unless there is a radical decline in circulation OC will not close anytime soon. Between OLY and OC combined papers printed for the week is about 32 million. Explain to me how OLY can acheive this and still grow the business??

Anonymous said...

if i had a silver spoon anonymous i would stuff it up youre ass to the knee joint along with my steel toed converse work shoes cowArd!

Mail Man said...

Philip, Nice to see your enthusiasm. How are you? I'd pay some serious money to see you do what you proposed, ala "UFC". Maybe we can do a fund raiser or a pay per view, show it on Tribune closed circuit, and donate the proceeds to reading by 9 or one of our many programs. Let’s use our energy and enthusiasm for a good cause. Now the only thing we need to do is find out who this “anonymous” blogger is. Does he have the testicular fortitude to come out of the closet? We shall see.

Anonymous said...

well I certainly would welcome the fun..but given that anon likes to stay fully closeted,and doesn't care that he is a "coward"who by his own omission lacks anything resembling credibility.I seriously doubt it,but would love to be proven wrong.
I feel even though the family has abandoned the paper,I try to treat everyone with respect and deference,unless provacated.so try as I might anon needs to drink more,come out of the closet,hurt small animals,or borrow the dull butter knife i gave myself a vasectomy with after reading miss.anonymous,and her postings.

Anonymous said...

Wow looks like some serious inbreeding in the Chandler clan

Anonymous said...

wow you can see are you sure everyone i speak too along with being a coward we can now add;deaf dumb and blind.stay anonymous that way I can still call you the pee pee stain that you truly are.inbreeding?self projection?are you sure you can read alright isn't the light kinda dim (like youre I.Q,?)with you being perpetually trapped in a closet?care to put a name other than coward behind youre rants?no didn't
think so?I promise not to have any children if you won't (probably too late for you)have any,how apprepo.keep writing coward,credibility?wrap youreself in youre anonymity,its the only thing credibile about you boy-child.boxers?briefs?or in youre case just depends?philip chandler

Anonymous said...

Do everyone a favor and take your medicine! Philip this is some pretty scary stuff...... I am so happy you arent going to reproduce we all thank you.

Anonymous said...

so you take medicine. maybe you should ask the psychiatrist to up youre dose.or maybe change youre prescription.since you insist on being a coward maybe you could find some better living thru chemistry,along with the new cloning discovery grow youreself the ball sac you lack.coward.
p.c.

Anonymous said...

Philip, One of the OC guys told me you were not allowed to vote with the rest of us in the election by the union guys watching. I never herd the full story on this and dont think it right someone is singled out just because they are a Chandler. What was with that?

I bet those guys now try to call you brother after they screwed you.

Anonymous said...

anon believe what you want,but knowing the history of animosity towards unions(harry chandler is buried next to victims of times bombing)by the family:current pressroom culture would have to be fairly bad to side with ronnie pineda.
being that I'm second born,a pisces,and a chandler:I'm a natural born diplomat.to that end:ronnie looks me int the eye,and gives me a firm handshake.russ newton slimed my hand with a weak dead fish,whilst his eyes wandered focused,and unfocused on anything but the person's hand he left a slime trail with.I'm still bothered by that experience.
no one is engaging in sabotage:power surge/electrical problem some weeks back noone could figure out went wrong;the company spent 10,000-12,000 changing locks on the mere unsubstantiated allegation of sabotage.
ronnies got platic knees;back to work in seven months.union bullshit aside? any of you out there want to come back from an injury like that in less that a year?: I'll take bets on who wins(my money is on ronnie).I suffered a severe knee injury,and am still not 100 percent ten years later.I don't like personal attacks they are divisive,unproductive,and contribute to an ongoing delay in meaningful issues to be brought to the forefront.
one thing about the union I'm happy for:I don't have to hear management (russ newton)talk down to us in those dumb ass corporate behaviour modification town hall fing meetings.makes want to vomit at the thought of russ newton speaking....thank you jesus..
philip chandler

Russ said...

Philip Chandler,

"I don't like personal attacks they are divisive,unproductive,and contribute to an ongoing delay in meaningful issues to be brought to the forefront."

Thanks for not attacking me.

Russ

Old OC said...

"Los Angeles Times club for pressmen and presswomen, with semi-annual dinners every March and October. The opinions here are that of each writer. THE RULES... (1) NO profanity or personal attacks. (2) Please stay on topic when making comments. (3) If rules one and two are not followed, your comments may not appear here."

Well so much for the rules!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

Thanks for reply Philip. I am still not sure what happened and it sound like you protecting Ronnie even though he would not allow you to vote in the election. I would be mad if it happen to me but I guess I miss something here.

Grandspud said...

Philip said...
"...I'm a natural born diplomat..."


Main Entry: diplomat
Part of Speech: noun
Definition: politician
Synonyms: agent, ambassador, attache, cabinet member, charge d'affaires, conciliator, consul, cookie pusher, emissary, envoy, expert, go-between, psychopath, legate, mediator, minister, moderator, negotiator, nuncio, plenipotentiary, representative, statesman, tactician


Hey Philip,
I checked the dictionary. According to one of the synonyms, you are a diplomat!

Anonymous said...

to each his own I don't have to defend anything or anyone since personal attacks are the flavor of this blog ..bon appetit!mama says baby fat tastes good!wanna come over and have dinner with and my mutha?*so Im a psychopath>youre a peestain I'll think of you when I see timmy peeing all over the central bathroom;his pee left alone will turn to ammonia;which will also remind me of you..... burning my nostrils...cheers.and russ I think it would be a personal attack if meeting you didn't really happen.besides you are not a pressperson you are upper level management that makes you in/subhuman by popular opine/consensus.yea and russ you were so enigmatic and impressionable in the town hall meetings oc voted union for the first time in over 35 years:good job!not!if you would have just stayed away not opened youre mouth to insert youre foot in to it oc probably would have voted the union down...but that issue is moot people.
hell... if psychopath means any of you are afraid to say hello:I'm not complaining.and yea I don't like personal attacks...but I never stated I would'nt engage in them I understabd the the nature of hypocrisy; and like mangaement do
I care?
semantics aside I feel a strong fiduciary obligation towards the people of the times..( worker drones,plebians)not the overpaid patricians whose domain is politcs,obsfucation,and town hall meetings.of which lately I haven't seen many of.
..thank you jesus.
p.c.

Wolf said...

Is this the most viewed of all postings?

Anonymous said...

Not only is this the most viewed of all postings, I think it may be the longest running soap opera.

Maybe even longer than All My Children. Can I be Erica?

Ronnie Pineda said...

Just for accuracy, I asked Ed to remove MY NAME, not the post. Ed apparently misunderstood my request and took down the original post.

Again,the text is from a Teamster publication and there is absolutely nothing wrong with the language or it's message.

I was not instructed by anyone to do anything about the post and only felt that Ed should remove my name simply because I did not not author the piece and he placed it there by mistake.

Anonymous, Thank's for putting it back here in the comments so that everyone who reads it knows you're imagination is out of your control and reading comprehension eludes you.

As far as you Granspud, You've won nothing and as far as being nervous, I don't hide my Identity. Sounds like you need some nerve.

Thank's to Phillip Chandler for addressing the cheap shots taken at me from people who have no vested interest in any of this for the fact that they don't work in the pressroom.

Try doing something positive for your peers in your department and maybe you'll understand.

Anonymous said...

Ronnie said...
"...Anonymous, Thank's for putting it (Solidarity Counts posting) back here in the comments so that everyone who reads it knows you're imagination is out of your control and reading comprehension eludes you..."


My 8th grade English teacher taught me a valuable technique. She emphasized the fact that well constructed paragraphs always contain a topic sentence or theme. To quickly comprehend a writing, she trained us to scan documents, picking out these topics and themes along the way.

Using that teacher's approach, I found I could reduce the most complex writing to it's very simple message. There was little challenge applying this to Ronnie's original post.

Paragraph #1
…Workers, on the other hand, have only their numbers to protect them...

Paragraph #2
…The union is only as strong the members who make up the unit…

Paragraph #2
…workers found that they were able to accomplish their goals through “ concerted activity.” concerted activity was deemed destructive...

Old OC said...

"Try doing something positive for your peers in your department and maybe you'll understand."

It would appear then, that doing your job may not be "something positive" for your peers? I've always thought that if I did the job that I was hired to do to the best of my ability that would help the company become successful and if the company was successful that was good for me, my family and my peers! But I guess I just don’t understand............

Ronnie Pineda said...

Your eigth grade teacher don't work here but if she did I'm sure she would have voted yes.
She no doubt a Union represented employee as most educators are.

There is absoulutely nothing wrong with the 3 verses you highlight and I have said the same things myself.

Name one thing that this bargaining unit has done can be considered destructive and we would not suggest that anyone participate in any activity that jeopardizes production or their careers.

I can't think of any more ways to say that, so I am done with this issue.

Kanani said...

For the record, I am closing out this thread for comments. No more comments will be posted.